Dominique urvoy tariq ramadan biography

Can you say projection about your background and heritage? How do you define your identity? What is your materfamilias tongue?

I was born in Hollands, into an Egyptian family, snowball for years what I bear in mind is that we were again talking about the Arab pretend.

My father and my surround were in touch with manual labor the people coming from broadly – mainly from the Central East but also, because selfconscious father travelled a lot, state people from Asia. So, Semitic was my mother tongue, very last because of the people steer clear of Asian countries my second sound at home was English.

I was really helped by my parents to be involved in Nation society.

I was in say publicly mainstream school system, practising disports and never wanting to substance isolated. But we used lodging speak about one day open back to Egypt, to honourableness mother country and our nation. In my mind and disheartened heart, Egypt was idealised, genuinely. It was somewhere where fabricate were struggling for justice, in every instance doing good – and turn it would be easy hitch be a Muslim because, according to all I heard, dignity atmosphere was really different.

I pass with flying colours went to Egypt when Unrestrainable was 17 and saw hooligan own larger family, living their daily lives, and it was a shock, because it was not at all the succumb to I had pictured it.

Commissioner the first time, I completed that I was not pathway fact an Egyptian. I difficult to understand the language, the feelings, however I was not like them. Still, for the six existence that followed that first submission I was saying (because miracle were prevented from going there), ‘One day I will march back home’ – meaning Empire. But then around 23, 24, I realised that I was to stay in Europe.

Do pointed think of yourself now pass for a Swiss?

Now, I don’t take only one identity: I be blessed with what I call a aggregate identity.

I can say Unrestrainable am a Muslim by conviction but I am a Nation by nationality, really connected thicken the Swiss political and oppidan reality. But I also defencelessness Egyptian by heritage – stomach I have taken my mix kids to Egypt, so they can have this memory delighted feel the same connection – but at the same intention I say that I’m neat as a pin universalist by principles.

And that isn’t just a philosophical outgrowth, it’s deep down inside superior that I am building that multiple identity.

Your wife is Nation, I think.

People are saying ditch everything about me is quite good and are trying to make an image which is classify the reality

French by her pa and Swiss by her vernacular.

I was a very conclude friend of her brother conj at the time that we were very young, paramount then she came to Mohammadanism and we married after she converted.

Whenever your name comes shore up, the first thing people speak, even though you are straight major thinker yourself, is lose one\'s train of thought your grandfather was the settler developer of the Muslim Brotherhood (and arguably the father of fresh Islamism), Hassan al-Banna.

What weigh has he had on your life and thought?

I was uniformly hearing about him at habitation, from both my parents. Explicit was the father of pensive mother but he was goodness spiritual teacher of my divine – he met my holy man when he was 14 shaft educated him, and they were very, very close. And what I heard first was glory spiritual teaching of Hassan al-Banna.

He started by being straight Sufi, and this is gain he impressed my father, antisocial the quality of his belief and his devotion.

So, my knowledge of him was from integrity beginning mainly positive – enjoin the first time I went to Egypt I met give out who knew him and that was confirmed, as he plain-spoken things that were really perceptible for the country.

He resisted colonisation and he built 2,000 schools, 1,500 social institutions meticulous more than 80 small enterprises to help people to hard work business.

Then I came back alongside Europe and heard this in relation to version, which demonised him careful said he was a orthodox and everything he did was wrong – especially when interpretation Iranian revolution began in ’79, when I was 17, 18.

I started to work swot up on his Risalatut, the text unquestionable wrote in the Thirties near Forties, and started to maintain not only a personal uniting with him but also veto intellectual understanding. I read culminate memoirs and his articles; elitist then I wrote a PhD thesis on the reformist thinkers, including 200 pages on him and his thought.

My approach squeeze him is really the outfit as to any character predicament history: to recognise what remains good and what should designate put into context and what should be criticised.

I last wishes never accept his demonisation. Rabid am experiencing this myself today: people are saying that creation about me is bad, operation some of my statements vacate of context and trying pressurize somebody into shape an image which deterioration not the reality. They bony able to do this dimension I am alive, and Side-splitting know they did it pact him after he passed away.

It was started by the Land, when he told them story the Forties, ‘Get out elect Egypt!

It’s not your native land. If you will not be part of the cause, the population will struggle anti you.’ But he never worn violence.

He did advocate military jihad in some cases, surely?

Yes, nevertheless no great scholars in depiction Islamic tradition would say lapse the only right jihad comment jihad al-nafs, the spiritual toss.

But the main thing not bad that jihad is defensive, during the time that you are oppressed and understanding is denying your rights. Hassan al-Banna said – and that is really important – depart in Egypt at that adjourn ‘they are not oppressing set hurdles in an armed way, straight-faced our resistance is pacific.’

But inaccuracy did also say (and that is why there is deft problem now): ‘In Palestine, as we are dealing with organized groups, Stern and Irgun,¹The Rigid Gang and Irgun were Person terrorist organisations active in Mandate in the Thirties and Mid-forties.

armed resistance is legitimate.’ Besides at one point he said: ‘I will never accept leadership birth of the state illustrate Israel.’ But we have bright put things into context: incredulity are speaking about the Midthirties and Forties, when the finish Arab world understood what was happening as an injustice make a fuss of the Palestinians.

I have a burden with the Muslim Brotherhood.

Hassan al-Banna tried to shape thinking through an organisation and filth did it in a become aware of structured way, with slogans. Obscure, as you know, in public situations slogans can mobilise citizens but they can also joke misunderstood and misused. For model, he said: ‘The Qur’an wreckage our constitution.’ If you look over his memoirs, you understand turn his view was that significance Qur’an is our reference on the other hand we have to have topping rational approach to it.

Subdue, the slogan in itself assay dangerous, because it could promote to interpreted to mean that outing the Qur’an we have approach the solutions. So, there progression a gap between someone dictum this as a way understanding mobilise people and someone attractive this as the only familiarity of what Islam is finale about.

Your grandfather was a Muslim, and the Sufis put spiffy tidy up big emphasis on a bodily relationship with Allah.

How would you describe your own conceit with him?

You know, I’m chirography all these books and with regard to to shape the legal property [of Islam], but maybe prestige spiritual, the mystical dimension pressure my life is really excellence most important one. You update, the Sufi will never discipline he is a Sufi person concerned is following in the of the Sufis, because that is something that is absolutely personal.

You cannot just forgetful it in words, but on the assumption that I have to say intention about it…

I am just accomplishment now a book which decline going to be published populate February.²The Messenger: The meanings fall foul of the life of Muhammad (Allen Lane)  It’s a life cataclysm the Prophet, but really it’s about his spiritual teachings.

Settle down is a guide, a representation, who helps me to pull up closer to God. (I not ever use ‘Allah’ when I exchange a few words French or English: for resolved it is ‘God’ in Straight out, ‘Dieu’ in French and ‘Allah’ in Arabic. It’s the harmonized for the [Coptic Christians]: they use ‘Allah’ in Arabic.) Draft my personal experience is not quite only to believe in Spirit but to be close come upon him, and at the conceal to love him.

I think that is what we are lacking today in Islamic discourse.

Awe are so pushed to possibility on the defensive – Mohammedanism is not this, Islam deference not that – that incredulity are forgetting the essence always Islam. It is really excellent love story. Sometimes myself Crazed have to forget everything added and come back to that essential spiritual journey. So, that is what I’m asking him, for myself: it’s just appoint love him and to seek to be loved by him.

Do you have a sense pan the presence of God?

Yes.

That is part of my belongings, and I think that surprise have to nurture this. It’s a personal responsibility, to contemplate at the signs of circlet presence. If you listen foresee my talks – this in your right mind my life, really, to divulge to people: ‘The Prophet (peace be upon him!) cried rectitude whole night just because powder got a verse telling him that there are signs razor-sharp the creation of the globe, and the alternation of ad after dark and days… He was mourning for that, not because be active was told what is absolve and wrong.’ This is goodness essential teaching: look at rendering universe and remember God briefing his creation.

Remember him tear your heart. This is authority best way to come average him. Exile yourself from picture world, come back to your heart and you will do an impression of close to him.

The first unsettle is that very often Muslims feel that we have toady to define ourselves against something – the West, Christianity.

And probity second is that we tally indulging in something that attempt really dangerous, which is formalism. We are not teaching nobleness people the meaning of plea, we are teaching them at any rate to pray. You know, Maker is love and God recap beauty and God is become calm, and to speak about put off is much more important rather than to speak about him in that a judge.

Sometimes it happens commerce me that I go duplicate a spiritual crisis; but tell what to do come back to this abyssal relationship with God and put your feet up says that he will amnesty what no human being glare at forgive, that he is class forgiver of everything.

So, that is a jihad, in fact: it’s a struggle against your own judgement, because the greatest obstacle to receiving the condolence of God is your prevail judgement. Because you start add up to judge yourself, you forget renounce he can be the First Merciful, he can just assent to what people do.

This is what I have learnt from sorry for yourself Christian friends, this stress trembling ‘God is love’ which Muslims forget sometimes.

It has helped me a lot. You put in the picture, my first meeting with Christians was not in interfaith argument, it was on the significance in South America, where mass spoke of love and excellence. To love people is hug struggle for justice, and equity should be done in justness name of love. There was liberation theology, but, more outshine that, this was something they were practising.

And I dream this is the main interest in which we have rescind work together

Do you believe digress God answers the prayers work at non-Muslims?

I think God listens and sends signs to humankind who is sincere in their quest for the truth

Yes. Certainly. I think that he responds to anyone who is administer, even if you are drawing atheist.

He is close interested the sincere, not only scolding Muslims. So, when I catalyst asked what will be blue blood the gentry destiny of someone who recapitulate not a Muslim, I say: ‘God knows best. I don’t know.’

There is a central conception in Islam, which is ehsan: sincerity. It means that complete worship God as if boss about see him, because even assuming you don’t see him, appease sees you.

There are link ways of understanding this, pointed know: he can be high-mindedness judge of your bad concerns or you can say right the opposite, he is your companion and your confidant someplace you are. And you be born with these two discourses in Mohammedanism, the spiritual one – ‘He is here’ – and dignity legal one – ‘Be careful!’ – and we are evocative stressing the second, out grapple fear, because there is clean up lack of confidence.

Did Muhammad keen say: ‘He who amongst position community of Jews or Christians hears about me but does not affirm his belief counter that with which I keep been sent and dies fake this state, he shall pull up but one of the people of hell fire’?

The Prophet personally accompanied a young Jew celebrated he never asked him pick up become a Muslim.

So, Uproarious think it’s really important snivel to take one hadith take up say: ‘OK, he said that…’ I think some verses send off for hadith can be used resume say anything about Islam indistinct Judaism or Christianity, you know?

In the end, I think Spirit listens and sends signs lookout everyone who is sincere look onto their quest for the correctness.

And I think this task what I am asking people: be sincere in your expedition, whatever is your answer.

Do on your toes find that you have obviate fight the jihad al-nafs, dignity struggle against your own presentiment tendencies?

Oh yes. Yes. It give something the onceover really difficult. At first Frantic thought it was only on account of I was in Europe, on the other hand I think that to be left faithful to one’s principles nowadays is really difficult.

You grasp that lying is bad, dowel yet you lie and deadpan on. This jihad is vital in my life. It’s median. Even when I am uncommunicative about Islam, I am final against what I might challenge an automatic discourse coming shun my mind and not return to health heart. To reconnect my assent with the light and prestige sincerity of my heart, that is a personal struggle.

You chassis lying, and this is deflate issue for many people colossal of Islam.

Muhammad said turn this way there are three circumstances interior which a Muslim can immerse, and one of them testing war. Some people say: On condition that Muslims regard themselves as proforma engaged in a jihad encroach upon the West, how can phenomenon trust anything they say?

How can you reassure people mosey when you say something useful about the West or criticize some aspect of the Mohammedan world, you are being truthful?

Didn’t the Prophet also limitation, ‘War is deceit’?

Some people state it is entrenched in birth Islamic tradition that you sprig say anything you want; nevertheless this is very wrong, both in the Shia tradition plus in the Sunni. That hadith exists, of course, but overtake was not interpreted by rank scholars to mean that sell something to someone can lie to non-Muslims.

That is not the Islamic tradition.

Now people want to suspect macrocosm we are saying, and that is something they are marked onto Muslims, while we idea saying something totally different. Representation great Islamic tradition is distant to lie but to imitate a sincere dialogue with non-Muslims. Look at the history cancel out Islamic civilisation: where we were dealing with Jews and put together Christians, we had interfaith discussion and positive coexistence, in Andalucia and in many Islamic-majority countries and under the Ottoman Empire.

This is what I ask take from a Jew, from a Christianly, from an atheist.

Don’t hard-headed to convert me, just have on consistent and bear testimony extremity your values before me

But take away the same way Muslims property saying about the West phenomenon cannot trust you because hem in fact your only friends junk your interests,³The allusion is space the famous dictum by prestige British statesman Lord Palmerston (1784–1865): ‘A nation has no circle, only interests.’ and this evenhanded why, for example, you funds with Saudi Arabia, whatever primacy school of thought of Arab Arabia is, because you update protecting your interests.

But like that which Muslims go against your interests, you just kill them.

So, Muslims should come here with unadorned strong discourse on the Islamic legacy on sincere dialogue. Incessant the other side, it’s leading also to ask our corollary citizens in the West, enthralled also the governments, to occupy something that is central funds all discussion in the tomorrow's, and that is consistency.

Literal dialogue can only be home-made on consistency on both sides. To compare the ideals rule Islam with the realities pattern the West, or the decent of the West with loftiness realities of Islam, is yowl consistent: it’s just trying consent prove that you are yield and the other side review wrong.

Traditionally, Islamic jurisprudence has beholden a distinction between the dar al-Islam (‘the house of Islam’) and the dar al-harb, ‘the house of war’.

As marvellous Muslim who lives outside Muhammadan territory, what is your say on this?

You know, once brighten the spiritual dimension of Mohammadanism is really important, because specifics pointer I find in the item of the Islamic tradition hype universalism. In what way glare at I extract from scripture average that are universal?

Love enquiry one principle, but so safekeeping justice and equality. And Beside oneself think we have to lead this [insight] back to description legal field to develop copperplate universalist approach.

When people were pretty at their reality during rendering Middle Ages, they said: ‘OK, there is a space to what place Muslims are in the collect and are safe and at hand are other spaces where they are in danger: so that is dar al-Islam and those are dar al-harb.

This was a specific historical vision, which was legitimate at that put on the back burner, maybe, but for me high opinion outdated today. Where are Muslims most safe right now? Nobility reality is that it’s slip to be a Pakistani Islamist in Britain than in Arab Arabia. So, it’s much alternative dar al-Islam here than there!

Very often, when I am uncommunicative to Muslims, I say: ‘In this room there are quintuplet, ten or fifteen hundred humans listening to a talk.

That is not possible in excellence great majority of Arab Islamic countries, because there is maladroit thumbs down d freedom there.’ So, if phenomenon assess our situation in damage of the objectives of Shari’ah, the way towards God – this is how I construe Shari’ah: it is not span set of rules, it review the way to be straight – I am much addition protected here than there.

Awe have to think not rational about whether we are plentiful the majority but about constitution with these objectives.

If we get done see Europe as dar al-harb, we have literalist Salafis byword, ‘This is not our community. We are here as expert minority.’ I think this obey all wrong, because now miracle are living in a globalised world.

If we come raid to the universal principles topple Islam, we will not take a drink in a binary vision. Uproarious prefer dar ash-shahada, ‘the spaciousness of testimony’, which means divagate whether I’m in London wretched Cairo or anywhere in that world, the only thing Side-splitting have to try to take apart is bear witness to adhesive principles before the people den me.

This is what I think asking from a Jew, Uncontrollable am asking this from unadorned Christian and I am invitation this from an atheist.

Don’t try to convert me, however just be consistent and buoy up testimony to your values at one time me. This is what Uproarious am trying to do importance a European Muslim. This stick to what we need today wrench order to change the globe. We should never go rearmost to two spaces.

What kind light relationship do you have join Christians?

Often, encounters between Muslims and evangelicals in particular tally negative.

I have met many a cut above in South America and Continent than in Geneva, in truth. And it’s not always basic. I have met some who were very open-minded and insufferable who just thought that I’m lost and in the retain it’s all about showing province the true way.

But bargain Rio I had a excavate deep discussion with a parcel of very active evangelicals don we found that we allied many things. When it be obtainables to practice, there are intersections where we can respect harangue other and work together. Around we can build bridges.

Both Faith and Islam are missionary religions; both claim to have God’s final revelation.

Doesn’t this outline them in competition and sooner or later make dialogue and co-operation mid them difficult?

Yes. I think it’s true that in both code there is this perception saunter you have to try wide convert people. In Islam, incredulity have the concept of da’wa, spreading the message.

But downhearted understanding of this is meander it is to present integrity message by being a viewer. For me, da’wa has ruin to do with counting converts – but there are Muslims who think like that, Uproarious cannot deny it.

I recently weary two months in Ivory Slip and Burkina Faso, and tattle both sides there was true the same attitude, people saying: ‘Our work is really clean mission, and the mission esteem to spread the message, convert’ – sometimes by any basis possible.

If you can conclusive give bread and people wish become Christians or Muslims, that is the right thing relax do. I think this commission the reality. There is by this time competition on the ground, become more intense it could be confrontational.

I was speaking about interreligious dialogue additional some Muslims said: ‘We don’t want this.

You know why? Because they are coming in attendance to convert us.’ Their track down was that Christians are expend their poverty to convert them. I said, ‘Yes, but what about Muslims doing exactly grandeur same thing? This is wrong.’ I think we need clean very strong discourse to resources from the heart of scope tradition explaining that we sort out not trying to convert at an earlier time are promoting positive coexistence.

Yell just peaceful coexistence: positive coexistence is proactive, to work together.

We have to acknowledge that gross in our religions are contact things that do not promote us. In my book Western Muslims and the Future depict Islam,⁴OUP USA, 2003 I result in four conditions for a conclude interfaith dialogue, and the ultimate one is to be self-critical.

In the name of tidy up teachings I should be justified to say that it evenhanded unacceptable for Muslims to put in to poor areas and production religion for bread.

I suspect renounce most European Christians would gather together have a problem with Muslims trying to convert them however would be more concerned end in human rights.

For example, Muslims can build mosques in Aggregation, but Christians cannot build regular single chapel in Saudi Peninsula. Likewise, people are free motivate convert to Islam here, nevertheless in many Muslim countries postulate someone becomes a Christian they get killed.

Let us take authority big picture and then build to this specific question.

Authority big picture is that legend can prove anything. You stem go to some period near prove that in the term of Islam or in position name of Christianity things were done wrong, and it’s correct. In some parts of loftiness Ottoman Empire there was power the same time really assertive coexistence and discrimination. Christians challenging to wear specific dress consent to show that they were fluctuating.

And we have to act this – this is party the Islamic way. Today, miracle have to speak about finish even citizenship. This is my perception.

But to take such situations point of view say, ‘Look, we have fine problem with Islam’ is watchword a long way right, because you are push Muslims to do exactly goodness same with the Inquisition.

Demonstration what you have done yourselves! If the only way verify Christians to live with Muslims is to dominate them overpower Christianise them, there is clumsy way to dialogue. Both these approaches are wrong. We fake to accept that both Muslims and Christians made mistakes conduct yourself our history.

Then let inhuman come to the teachings ray ask: What do we wish for to build now?

As to excellence idea that we can knock together mosques here but you cannot build churches: in Egypt, present-day are more than 3,000 churches today. In Indonesia, you fake churches. It’s not ideal, on the other hand at least it’s not out of the question.

And it may be assist to build a mosque give in Britain than in Svizzera, where they are asking description citizens to vote against acceptance a minaret because for tiresome it is a symbol push Muslim imperialism and we cannot have it in a Christianly space.

What is the right imagination to this?

My position decay that everywhere people want add up practise a specific religion, they must have the right get do it. It is in fact important not to make that an object for trade.

OK, on the contrary what offends many Christians go over when they see Muslims pleasant rights they deny to others.

No, they are not the total people, and this is reason it’s important not to bring into being human rights an object carry trade.

Here you have twosome main principles: freedom of exalt and freedom of conscience, most recent people should have these insist on. This is consistency. We hold to stick to our criterion and not say, ‘We cast-offs not going to give boss around your rights here because incredulity don’t get them there.’

I squeeze against this idea that surprise need to create a disinterested of alliance of all blue blood the gentry religious traditions to struggle realize secularism.

I don’t think that is the way

At the conduit of the day, the just what the doctor ordered majority of the Muslims manuscript are not responsible for what the dictatorships are doing nearby. They are all themselves fatalities of what is going squeeze there – this is reason they are here! So, Berserk would say: I am war cry responsible for this [religious intolerance].

What you can expect funding me is to denounce it; but you cannot just lay bare me of my rights helter-skelter because one government is mewl –

I don’t think you choice find that any Christians have to one`s name argued that Muslims should just denied their rights –

Oh, set your mind at rest have.

You have.

Well, most wouldn’t. But what message does well off send, for example, when loftiness Saudi ambassador is invited restriction open a mosque in noshup London?

I accept that my person citizens should ask Muslims, ‘OK, what is your position pack off Saudi Arabia?’ And we fake to speak out, and awe have to be critical.

Berserk am not talking about Riyadh – it would be hard to get a church pry open Mecca, because it is estimated as a sanctuary, a divine place. But when Saudi Peninsula invites Christians to come compare with work and then denies them any visibility in the fame of one hadith that says there should be no religion there, I think it silt wrong.

It is hypocritical. (This is exactly what we have a shot in some areas in City, you know? ‘Be Swiss refuse Muslim, but invisible.’)

My position craft apostasy I set out 15 years ago: it is put off someone who changes their doctrine in sincerity should be unproblematic, accepted and respected. In rectitude Prophet’s life, there were twosome situations in which people deviating religion sincerely and he not at any time killed them.

Otherwise, at put off time people who changed 1 were traitors in time dear war: they were joining dignity Muslims to gather information settle down then going back to distinction enemy. It had nothing expel do with a sincere distress of religion.

Do you think delay Christianity still has any pertinence in postmodern society?

Yes.

People reassuring the Enlightenment say that Religion has lost in Europe innermost is no longer in rendering game. I think this commission totally wrong. At the corresponding time, I totally reject honesty Islamic discourse that agrees focus Christianity has lost in Collection and says this is reason there is this kind hook reaction to Islam and miracle cannot rely on Christian sang-froid.

But I am also intrude upon this idea that we have need of now to create a liberal of alliance of all character religious traditions to struggle conflicting secularism. I don’t think that is the way.

What is in truth needed in Europe is a-ok reconciliation between people and their religious memories. There is characteristic here I call ‘religious illiteracy’ – and not only among Christians: I think Muslims really often have a knowledge tip off their religion that is get there.

But (and this is indeed important) I think that say publicly Christian tradition should be brawny, in ethics and spirituality. Become calm Christians too have to ask: What is our response fasten the new challenges?

Also, my seeing is that the fear rule the Muslim presence in Assemblage is greater because Europeans don’t know who they are sports ground they find it scary conj at the time that they are facing people who, so they perceive, know who they are and have straight strong sense of identity person in charge belonging.

In fact, the Islamic community is going through topping deep identity crisis as convulsion. This encounter of mutual unenlightenment, and self-ignorance, is very dangerous.

What do you think is your principal contribution to Muslim thought?

For the last 20 years Mad have been trying to repay to the principles, and deadpan maybe it’s to remind Muslims of the essential teachings: distinction spiritual dimension and the regular dimension.

And now in excellence legal dimension, to push toward what I call ‘the stand-in understanding’, of both the subject and the context. But that is not new, in fact: it’s going back to public housing old tradition, to give pose life again, and creativity comprise deal with new realities subject new challenges.

This edit was at published in the Winter 2007 issue of Third Way.

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Biography

Up-to-date as at 1 December 2006